Smoke And Engine Oil Consumed Fast

Sounds like the initial problem might have been a "double-gasket" condition on the first oil filter that Wal-Mart installed. When the Wal-Mart tech removed the first oil filter, the o-ring gasket for that filter stuck to the engine block rather than coming off with the filter. When the new filter was installed, it was installed over the first gasket. When one filter gasket is put over another, there is almost always a huge leak, though the filter will seem perfectly tight and properly installed. I did this once on my 1994 Mazda B4000 4WD. The engine puked oil like a sick maniac until I noticed it. Fortunately, I noticed it before any engine damage was done. It sounds like you were not so lucky. My guess is that this huge (but temporary) leak caused the engine to become oil-starved, get hot, and start blowing things up inside. I think Wal-Mart probably got rid of the evidence of this when you bought it back to them. Bummer. This is why you are always supposed to put a thin film of oil on the filter gasket when you install it...to keep it from sticking to the engine black. Most low-rent Jiffy Lube and Wal-Mart techs don't do this, which is why I always change my oil myself. One time, a Jiffy Lube guy completely forgot to put oil in my father's truck (he DID manage to change the filter correctly, though! ) . Only the fact that my father checked the oil before he left Jiffy Lube kept him from having his engine blow up. Anyway, sorry to hear of your misfortune, and I hope it all works out. Regards, Aaron

We just took the car back from dealer,they had it repaired for 2 weeks.

We got a report,which I don't understand all of them,maybe somebody can tell me what does it means.

1. rework CYL HEAD and resurfaced, completed

2.CK engine using oil - 1 QT every 1000 miles

Engine cyclinder walls scored

Inspect - removed plugs to inspect W/Boroscope - removed engine and replaced with short block ****y.,replaced spark plugs/ver haul;gasket kit/oil and filter/refilled with coolant O.K.

So it seemed the problem is scored cyclinder walls,and they rework it,and replaced spark plugs,gasket kit,oil and filter? That means we don't need to replace spark plugs again in the 60000 miles maintenance?

The dealer said we have extend 2 year/24000 miles warranty for this repair.

OK, sounds like you got essentially a new engine. Nice deal.

Who paid for this?

OK, sounds like you got essentially a new engine. Nice deal. Who paid for this?

Factory warranty payes:2193$

 

 

Yesterday it run smoothly, but today we have another problem...

This morning, every time we met a stop sign,or when we stoped, the engine got lower and lower rev speed until stop, we have to start it again. This is almost identical to the situation that you didn't disengage the clutch when stop a manual car, the engine just was choked to stop.

So I felt it was a problem of the connection between transimission and engine,we left the car to dealer for check.

Our poor little corolla...

Sounds like the initial problem might have been a "double-gasket" condition on the first oil filter that Wal-Mart installed.

I've never had that happen to me until recently...and then the last two oil changes I have done to my wifes car the old Fram oil filter left the gasket on the car...

 

First thing I do is start the car on the ramp to make sure I didn't nick the filter or do anything dumb...after about 10 seconds I hear this 'spluush' noise, turn the car off...

Oil everywhere...took me a while to realize what happened...oh well, I just flushed the oil with Mobile 1, *sigh*

Next oil change, I didn't remember until I started seating the new filter...I was like, this has too much give, remembered what happened last time, sure enough there is the old gasket still on the engine...

At least I didn't give her a very expensive oil flush...

G

the old Fram oil filter left the gasket on the car...

sure enough there is the old gasket still on the engine...

That's what you get for using an aftermarket oil filter. The Toyota engineers have already thought about the potential problem of the old filter gasket accidentally getting left on the engine so they designed an "O" ring seal to eliminate the problem. They also used extra deep threads on the fitler to hold it more securely to the engine: http://www.saber.net/~monarch/filter.jpg

 

Toyota filters have numerous fail safe features like these two so that is why using a Toyota filter is the least risky way to maintain your Toyota.

Today we were told the car is ready, it was said there was a problem with a spring for idle speed. We took the car,found that the enginewas still shaking when stopped, although it didn't stall.

The dealer took it back again.

Sigh, I'm convinced that the repair can bring more problems. Anyway, the work they did to engine was a big one.

Your first line is pure BS. I took off the Purolator filter I was using when I changed the oil on tuesday, and there was no stickage. It's failure to oil the gasket which causes that problem, not the brand of filter.

No Jeff, the problem is the gaskets on the aftermarket filter are flat gaskets which can sometimes stick to the engine block. So when the stereotypically sloppy and inattentive Walmart tech or Jiffy Lube tech screws on a new aftermarket filter, the gasket of the new filter mates with the gasket from the old filter still left on the engine block resulting in a leak.

 

None of this can happen with the O-ring gasket that Toyota uses on it's filters because an O-ring can't stick to the engine block.

Fram filters are widely known to be the worst garbage in existence. They sure are a purty orange color, though. Google around -- there are several places where people have disAssembled filters to critique the construction. Take a look at the cheap carboard and shoddy tin for yourself. I especially like the metal shavings you can often find on the cheesy threads on a Fram. (Open a few up next time you'er at Wal*Mart.)

Oddly enough, the cheapo "SuperTech" filters sold as the Wal*Mart house brand have proven to be quite good. And they conveniently use the same numbering system and they're right next to the Frams at Wally*World...

I use either real live Toyota filters or Purolator "Pure1" filters. The Pure1 filters don't use an o-ring, but they do have a teflon coating on the seal that prevents it from sticking, plus the housing is crimped so that it hangs on the the seal.

BTW, following a cold-motivated midwinter oil change at the dealer, I have seen the o-ring on a Toyota filter stick and start to pull out when removed. They are not immune to this problem.

The Pure1 filters are the only ones I've seen that make an actual visible difference -- in my car, the oil looks much cleaner after 5,000 miles than with any other filter. Independent testing and critiques confirm that Pure1 filters do filter better. There is some concern that they may therefore clog a bit faster, but that would only be a problem in cases of severe wear and/or neglect.

Best of all, they're only about $1 more than regular Purolators -- maybe $4 on sale, $5 or $6 each not on sale.

The Pure1 filters don't use an o-ring, but they do have a teflon coating on the seal that prevents it from sticking, plus the housing is crimped so that it hangs on the the seal.

BTW, following a cold-motivated midwinter oil change at the dealer, I have seen the o-ring on a Toyota filter stick and start to pull out when removed. They are not immune to this problem.

It's easy to show how the Purolator PureOne oil filter seal can stick to a verticle surface: http://www.saber.net/~monarch/pure1.jpg

 

I havn't been able to get a Toyota filter seal to stick to a smooth verticle surface:

http://www.saber.net/~monarch/filter2.jpg You mentioned you saw a Toyota seal start to pull out from the filter, but you did not actually see it cling to the engine after the filter was removed.

The Pure1 filters don't use an o-ring, but they do have a teflon coating on the seal that prevents it from sticking, plus the housing is crimped so that it hangs on the the seal.

BTW, following a cold-motivated midwinter oil change at the dealer, I have seen the o-ring on a Toyota filter stick and start to pull out when removed. They are not immune to this problem.

It's easy to show how the Purolator PureOne oil filter seal can stick to a verticle surface: http://www.saber.net/~monarch/pure1.jpg

 

I havn't been able to get a Toyota filter seal to stick to a smooth verticle surface:

http://www.saber.net/~monarch/filter2.jpg You mentioned you saw a Toyota seal start to pull out from the filter, but you did not actually see it cling to the engine after the filter was removed.

dragqueen=Paul Cherubini?????

 

Are we seeing another alias for the much-abused PC?

By the way, take anything rubber and flat, coat it with oil, and it will stick to the fridge door for a short time. It's called adhesion.

Also, the last 4 Toyota filters I got from the dealer here in Canada all had flat seals, not the miraculous o-ring so touted by PC.

Also, the last 4 Toyota filters I got from the dealer here in Canada all had flat seals, not the miraculous o-ring so touted by PC.

DC, here is Larry Roll's picture of the 2003 Corolla oil filter seal

 

http://img8.exs.cx/img8/4277/Toyota90915YZZA2OilFilter.jpg

As you can see it is an "O-ring" design that can't stick to the oil filter mounting plate. All Toyota oil filters have used this fail safe design for the past 30+ years.

Today we got the car back from dealer finally. It has been 10 days!! And a month from we began the service.

Fortunnatelly, the warranty covered all the bill, and include 10 days rental fee (dealer arranged the rental 10 days ago, maybe they felt guilty for too much delay too)

It was said that there was a problem with some valves, and they ordered some new parts, then the mechanic drove it home to see if it will cold start normally in morning. They drove 120 miles and consumed some gas, I don't know what we can say for this, I thought it's impossible to get some refund for this.

We were told we have extended warranty of engine for 12 months or 12,000 miles. I assume that is for the whole engine, not only the parts they changed.

I wish this is the final result, and I will take good care of our car.

I'd pass on that. It was good of them to do an extended checkout and the price of the gas is a small cost for that in my opinion.

I'd pass on that. It was good of them to do an extended checkout and the price of the gas is a small cost for that in my opinion.

Agree.

 

Besides, today when I cold start the engine in morning, it shaked for a while, especially in speed of walking pace, after 1 minutes the shaking dissapeared. It was different from last time, the shaking was not very big but still noticable, but the engine was quiet when we fully stopped.

Does that mean just cold start or some not perfect tune up?

Your first line is pure BS. I took off the Purolator filter I was using when I changed the oil on tuesday, and there was no stickage. It's failure to oil the gasket which causes that problem, not the brand of filter.

No Jeff, the problem is the gaskets on the aftermarket filter are flat gaskets which can sometimes stick to the engine block. So when the stereotypically sloppy and inattentive Walmart tech or Jiffy Lube tech screws on a new aftermarket filter, the gasket of the new filter mates with the gasket from the old filter still left on the engine block resulting in a leak.

 

None of this can happen with the O-ring gasket that Toyota uses on it's filters because an O-ring can't stick to the engine block.

I always oil the gasket before I put the new filter back on.

 

I've been using Fram for about 10 years now, as long as I've been driving and changing my oil.

Past couple oil changes are the first time I've ever seen the ring stick.

I don't know what is going on...other than I'm changing to a different brand and I'm always going to check before I put a new filter on.

Oh, and I am always going to change my own oil too...

My new Corolla came with a five year deal with the dealership, free oil changes every 5000 miles, free inspection lube, free wash, free lunch, etc etc...shame I don't trust them enough to ever touch my car again...

Sorry for hijacking your thread.

G

I have read that in alot of cases the only difference between the factory oil filters and the aftermarket ones is the paint job. I don't think that Toyota or any other manufacturer has their own in-house oil filter factory (at least not anymore), and most of the production of these kinds of parts is farmed out to aftermarket companies like Purolator and Fram. It is just not financially smart for automakers to make these maintenance items in-house when other aftermarket companies can do it cheaper. They take the same Fram or Purolator filter, slap a Toyota paint-job on it, and charge twice as much for it. Believe it.

The only time I have double-gasketed a filter is when I took off of the filter on my Mazda truck. This was the first time that I had changed the oil. It was a Fram, and I replaced it with a Fram. I don't think that "oil adhesion" is a factor here, as the gaskets fit pretty snugly in the filter housing. There is not enough adhesion to pull the gasket off of the filter The problem is when dumbass techs don't put a coat of oil on the gasket, and the gasket essentially bakes onto the block. Whether it is an o-ring gasket or a flat gasket, ANY piece of rubber that is compressed between two metal surfaces and subjected to 200-400 degrees of heat WILL stick to the block...unless it is oiled. Valve cover gaskets are a perfect example of this, only in their case it would be really hard to install one gasket over another! As long as the gasket is oiled, it doesn't matter what kind of filter you use.

Fram sells TENS OF THOUSANDS of filters every year, and they have sold them for decades. Kneeling in front of the Toyota Service Department counter and worshipping Toyota "factory service parts" is a waste of money, and that is exactly what Toyota WANTS you to do. Waste your money! If Toyota or Mazda or whoever had that big of a problem with Fram or any other manufacturer of aftermarket service products, then they would not allow such parts to be used to meet THEIR warranty requirements. Regards, Aaron

if i had the time to pass by at toyota dealership i buy the original oil filter for my oil change. sometimes if convenient i buy ryco premium oil filter and synthetic oil at supercheap auto here in brisbane, queensland australia. no problem encountered whatsoever and could not find any difference in performance.

visit www. rycofilters.com.au for product info.

rey t

Cobrajet25:

I don't know where you get the idea that genuine Toyota-brand oil filters cost twice as much as those made by Fram or other lesser-quality aftermarket brands. I purchased a case of genuine Toyota 90915-YZZA2 oil filters for my Corolla for only $3.99 each -- I have never found an aftermarket filter priced less than that. Of course, I probably wouldn't use it anyway! If I were to run out of my Toyota-brand filters, which won't happen for at least three years given my present supply, I'd go for a Purolator or a Wix. Those are the only brands I'd leave on the engine for the whole duration of an oil change interval. If I had to use a Fram, I'd change it as soon as I could secure another supply of Toyota filters.

Larry,

Perhaps you got a bulk discount on your filters by buying a full case. I called my local Toyota delaership, and they wanted $6.68 for the same filter number you referenced. Either your dealership just loves you, or my dealership is gouging me! I have used Fram for years and have never had trouble, and they are $3.24 at Wal-Mart. I have no problem with the Toyota filters (I am sure they are great) but I am also pretty sure Toyota has NOTHING to do with making them. Most likely, they are made in China or Hong Hong like everything else these days (what does the box say?). As for Fram et al., if they are good enough to meet Toyota's warranty requirements then they are good enough for me. Plus, they are still made in North America which counts for something, to me at least. Regards, Aaron