Toyota Reliability With Forced Induction

When toyota rolls out a car with forced induction, how is the reliability of the car, engine, and transaxle (especially longevity) compared to one that is NA?

I'm really highlighting the 2zz-ge but some information on past cars would be nice. The reason I ask is because my parents want to buy a Louts. But cannot decide between the Lotus Elise (2zz 190hp NA) or Lotus Exige S (2zz 220hp Supercharged). The transmission is the same as the celica GTS for both vehicles.

i would imagine that the supercharger adds some extra wear items, the super charger itself, extra belt and or extra tensioner and idlers. that trans is pretty strong from what i've heard, and the 2zzge is a good engine. i know they dont pump alot of extra power through, 190 to 220 isnt a huge increase and these are at the crank figures. a NA 2zzge with the right tuning and a couple boltons can do 190 at the wheels, so thats atleast 200-205 at the crank. an extra 30hp i dont think is going to break anything that much faster. besides, im sure it comes with a pretty conservative tune, like every factory force fed vehicle.

Very Cool. A new Lotus or lightly used? I don't know how the availability is, but here in Northern Virginia, there is a 12 - 18 month+ waiting list to get them new (up to 24 months on the S). I tried to get the plain Elise a couple of years ago - but eventually let that go, since I didin't want to wait THAT long, a car is worth that kind of wait. I also wasn't willing to pony up an extra $20K for a used one either - for that kind of money, I could buy two Mini Cooper S or get a brand spanking new ZO6 Vette. Exclusivity will do that - I think that there are only like 350-400 Exige made every year?!

Now, as for reliability - rule of thumb: unless the drivetrain and engine were designed for forced induction from the very beginning - guaranteed that it will suffer more stress than the unblown variant. As Lotus uses identical engines between the Elise and Exige S - aside from a 7PSI blower on the Exige S - you can bet money that the blower will shorten the life of that supercharged variant.

Granted - the 2ZZ-GE and 6-speed transaxle are very tough pieces from the beginning. Designed to survive very high RPMs and takes to power adders very well. Also keep in mind that Lotus had to use their "own" ECMs. They got no help from Toyota on that - but I don't know if that is a pro or con.

Also think of the car's intended purpose - neither the Elise or Exige are what most would call a daily driver. Sure they are fun, handle and drive like a go-cart, and look exotic. But with very spartan interior, heavy investment in chassis tuning and handling - reliability is not one of the targets that Lotus was shooting for. Most will have a life spent being trailer from road event to road event - with a good portion of its mileage being put on at the track. One guy at work had one for a little while - but he ended up trading it in for a M3. The Lotus was just unhappy on the street - really thrives on the track and track only.

Since you live in Cali - I would ask myself, if I buy Lotus model X - will I be looking to add more power later? If yes, then I would definitely not worry about reliability and go for the Exige S. Don't need the attention of the smog police if you are looking at an aftermarket options later down the road - just get it from the start. Also, if you do get it - get ready for "We've seen this before" kind of comment from a Lotus dealership - these cars have a lot of minor problems but nothing major (knock on wood). It won't strand you but it may sometimes test your patience. Also test drive the heck out of them - the earlier ones had decent sightlines, not good compared to other cars, but better then the 2007+ Lotus models. On those, there is a blind spot big enough to blanket a school bus - not kidding at all.

Yea, out here in cali, I can pick one up tomorrow and drive it off the lot if I wanted to. I went to a dealership in newport where they had 25 brand new elises exige S 220's and 240's as well as a club racer (baby blue with black racing stripe). I would think that the less weight would put less stress on the car as a whole. I'm trying to think what could go wrong? There is almost nothing in the interior, and all the essential mechanicals are from Toyota. The Lotus should be a long lasting car.

 

Problem is, ultimate handling is achieved with the Exige's body kit that the Elise just doesn't have. Also, the Elise just looks a little too "cute and girly" next to an Exige. However, better fuel economy and probably more life out of the engine will come with the Elise over the Exige. Still hard to say which one. The Exige just looks focused and great with its fastback and spoiler.

You said that there is a difference between the 2005 elise and the 2007+ elises? That visual range from the cabin was better in a 2005? I've tried to find differences between the 2005-2008 Elises and I cant find a difference at all; aesthetically. (except the SC and california)

I guess I'll chime in, since I have some experience in this as well. I have an 05 Elise, and I used it as a daily driver for about a year. Now I use it as more of an occasional daily driver and autocross car (SS and FP class, for those who autoX). I also know people with aftermarket supercharged and turbocharged Elises. Some are daily driven. Some are flogged on road racing tracks frequently.

I wouldn't have any concerns whether the supercharged version would mean much more wear and tear. Even the hardest driven cars have held up extremely well. Besides, that increased power is only utilized when the car is driven all out. For street driving, I wouldn't expect the car to be driven very hard (compared to its abilities). Keep in mind that Lotus knows many of their cars will be used at the track, so they're not going to use parts that can't hold up to heavy use.

I know someone competing with a 380HP Elise, and he is still using the stock transmission. His car uses the 2ZZ engine it came with, plus a large turbo, and had a lot of internal parts changed. His car is purpose built, lightened, has plenty of downforce, and will never be street legal again. It is scary fast! If the stock C64 can hold up to that, you shouldn't have to worry about it holding up to street use.

As far as the Elise vs. Exige question; The Exige is a bit heavier, but it produces a bit more downforce (I think it is around 120lbs more at 100mph). Unless it will be driven at the track, the decision really boils down to aesthetics and visibility through the rear window. The base Exige is a bit more difficult to see out the back. The Exige S, as Fish mentioned--forget it. For daily driving- where you have to do things like backing out of parking spaces, the Elise is much easier to deal with.

My advice for test drives - Get in and out of the car several times and make sure you'd/they'd be comfortable doing that frequently. Trust me- it will take a few tries to get it right.

You know, I would love to have the normal Exige (not as stressful on the engine and better fuel economy). But weirdly enough, I've never seen a "regular" Exige. The only ones I've seen are the S's. Up until now, I didn't even know that the NA Exige was even available to north america. But, if you guys say that its available for purchase, I'll just have to look harder. The only year, and I mean only, Exige I've found is 2007+.

So, Dan_H, what type of fuel economy do you get in your Elise?

http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/downloa...elise_panel.pdf

38mpg!!!!!

You know, I would love to have the normal Exige (not as stressful on the engine and better fuel economy). But weirdly enough, I've never seen a "regular" Exige. The only ones I've seen are the S's. Up until now, I didn't even know that the NA Exige was even available to north america. But, if you guys say that its available for purchase, I'll just have to look harder. The only year, and I mean only, Exige I've found is 2007+.

So, Dan_H, what type of fuel economy do you get in your Elise?

http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/downloa...elise_panel.pdf

38mpg!!!!!

The normally aspirated Exiges were available in '06.

 

I think I've average about 32mpg cruising at 75mph. It is difficult to tell, since I usually mix and match city and highway miles...