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ycr99

Scion

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The Toyota salesman that sold me the RAV explained that the SCIONs are marketed to appeal to the twentysomethings. In fact, just prior to rolling them out, he attended a training seminar to learn how to work with the Generation Y crowd they hoped would be beating a path to their door.

 

He said it was Toyota's contention that they were missing out on the Gen Ys because the name recognition wasn't appealing to them. They thought that the younger car buyers wouldn't want the same car their parents would buy, and the SCION's concept from design to sales was conceived using a blank slate.

 

Since a new generation of buyers would have a different attitude and desires than their predecessors, SCIONs had to have a service concept that met these different demands. The SCION website allows them to select the model, the desired options, etc. and then the customers would be showing up at the showroom with a printout, ready to order.

 

When the traditional method of car buying meant searching a dealer's lot, test-driving several models, and haggling over the "best price" - the SCION concept gave the dealer the advantage of setting the price bar before a buyer showed up. Moreover, the website would indicate if the desired model was in stock before venturing to the dealer.

 

Time will tell if the concept is successful in appealing to Gen Y buyers. Meanwhile, the only people I've seen buying the xBs are older than I am...

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Guest strawberry

apparently from what i have read, the toyota name is a bit stodgy for the younger set. so being a big corp, toyota just made more new toyotas rebadged as scion, made the website and literature more cool and appealing to the younger crowd and now hopes to sell a gob of them. really haven't seen many of them in my area. the A is kinda neat-really wish that the corolla came as a 4door hatch. the B i think would be really practical and hold alot of stuff with that rear seat folded down. it's so ugly that it's kinda cute. i remember laughing out loud when i saw my first one on the road. it always reminds me of either an old fashioned milk delivery van or an ice cream truck. i bet ya it's a scream to watch going down the freeway at 60 mph. the C is ok but i'm not big on 2 door sporty looking coupes anymore since i've made it to my 50's. i really could see me buying a B one of these days. but of course i still have 53 more payments to go on my corolla b4 i even think about getting a new vehicle. heaven knows what will be available then but i know that i will always go with toyota. REALLY want a rav4 but they're out of my budget. but for what you get for the doe coupled with the reliability factor, i think that corolla is unbeatable.

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I really do think Scion is Toyota's biggest mistake. The Xb seems to be selling sort of well cause I do see a few of them on the road, but overall, I really don't see that many of them.

 

All Toyota needs to do is make real sporty Toyota's that don't break the bank. I don't think any automaker has figured out that older RWD cars still have a really high demand. Any RWD import still holds a lot of value today. More then it should anyway. Toyota needs to bring back the Corolla GTS, the Celica GTS RWD versions, and only price them 3000 above what a FWD version would cost cause really, it doesn't take that much more to make a car RWD. I don't give a ratts @ss about drifting, but newer RWD light weight imports would sell big time. They need LSD stock, and they need TRD support. They WILL sell. Toyota lost Celica sales cause they were over priced FWD cars and the MR2 Spyder was was over priced for not having the GT-S engine.

 

Scions are basicly factory rice cars and they do have a small market, but more young kids today want real performing cars. Anyone notice how many SRT-4s are on the road? Toyota could sell a good solid RWD car with nice suspention and a real LSD and then let the owners buy TRD SCer for more power. Toyota doesn't realize how many 05/06 Corolla owners are waiting to throw down money on a TRD SCer that isn't avaliable yet.

 

Toyota just assumed that only old people like Corolla's and that simple isn't true. If they started selling RWD versions again, they would sell every single one of them quickly. I'm 31 years old, I HATE ricy cars, fake wannabe tunners, but I do like our 5sp LE. I already got used XRS rims and tires for it and a TRD filter. Even tho nothing short of a SCer is going to add a lot of power, it's light and it has some nice suspention support for it. In the end, I want to do TRD springs, KYB GR2 shocks, sway bars, and upgraded tires. A TRD axle back exhaust would be nice, but that sure is over priced. It will never be a fast car, but just with the new rims and tires is so much more enjoyable to drive then stock. For someone who doesn't really break the speed limit too much, haveing a car that can be tossed around and corner well is really fun. Having a RWD version with LSD and 4:10 gears (like the really old supra had) would be so much nicer. I also think having a car that handles great is so much safer too. For younger import guys, it's not just about going really fast. Sometimes it is, but the MX-5 sells really well and it started out with a 1.6l, then got a 1.8l, and for 06 it gets a 2.0l 4cyl engine, but it's popular cause it handles so freaken well. It doesn't have to be fast to be a true performer. Lots of young kids do solo II autocross and for that, suspention helps out way more then power does.

Edited by gvr4ever

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I don't like the way Scions look, except the Tc. I also don't like the central instruments on the XA and XB. As for power vs handling, I will say this: The Mazda 3s I'm driving handles really well, unless you punch it too hard. The extra power that kicks in above a certain point is actually a detriment to driving the car briskly but safely. I'm firmly convinced that handling is more important that massive power. Ultimatley, massive power and handling would be put together into a car, but there are very few inexpensive cars that have both.

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Insurance is key. The youth market already spends a small fortune in liability coverage alone, and I'm not even thinking about the street tuner and drift sects.

 

Toyota won't in good common sense or conscience produce and market a car that encourages a younger buyer to become a freelance daredevil. The insurance costs would exceed the note payment for a twentysomething buyer.

 

Let 'em hunt down an older RWD rice burner at a salvage yard and drift/wreck it to their heart's content. Chances are they aren't looking for those to drive to school/work every day anyway.

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Insurance is key. The youth market already spends a small fortune in liability coverage alone, and I'm not even thinking about the street tuner and drift sects.

 

Toyota won't in good common sense or conscience produce and market a car that encourages a younger buyer to become a freelance daredevil. The insurance costs would exceed the note payment for a twentysomething buyer.

 

Let 'em hunt down an older RWD rice burner at a salvage yard and drift/wreck it to their heart's content. Chances are they aren't looking for those to drive to school/work every day anyway.

 

 

RWD doesn't = rice burner. Insurance companies ask owners (on sporty type cars) if they are going to race them. I guess they could lie, but then they could be dropped for life if they got in trouble on the track.

 

Toyota made a stupid car line to try and connect with the youth. The only people they have connected with is young people who only buy by image. It might be the options, or the stereo, or maybe even the way the car looks, but they don't really buy it because of the way they drive.

 

I think Toyota would have better luck making cars that just drive better. I would rather have a new RWD Corolla, but I can't buy one. So, I'm in the market for a used Mustang because it's a RWD car and that's what I want. A RWD acually drives nicer. Putting steering and power to the same wheels only gains in less drivetrain loss. That's the only good thing about it. Now days traction control is becomming standard and RWD with LSD and traction control would be plenty safe.

 

I'm a really big Toyota fan because they build a great Camery and Corolla, but tring to sell silly Scions isn't helping the Toyota image at all. If anything it is hurting it. Also, I can't buy the type of car I want from Toyota because they don't make it. I know I'm not alone on this. Lots of import fans end up getting Mustangs because they want RWD and they just arn't made anymore by Toyota and others.. Toyota's and others loss.

 

RWD doesn't = bad drivers either. Stupid kids will be stupid and most of them drive Honda's :)

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I've noticed Toyota and other Japanese car brands make cars in other countries that they don't sell in the U.S.

 

I am mollified when I see a big GMC SUV on Japan's narrow roads...(they don't even have sidewalks!!)

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I would absolutely love a RWD corolla. Unfortunately, I think FWD vehicles are easier and cheaper to produce than RWD so there is really no reason for car makers to go for the RWD design from a financial point of view. As much as we love Toyota, they are after all a corporation and their main purpose when it gets boiled down is to increase their profit margines.

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Toyota used to sell a RWD Corolla back in the 80s. It really isn't that hard to make a car RWD and it doesn't cost that much more. A drive shaft and rear axle doesn't cost that much more. Also, it's better to have a shifter at the transmission then using shifter cables for FWD.

 

I'm not expecting for Toyota to ever make a RWD Corolla or Celica ever again, but I don't understand why they stopped in the first place. As far as making money. Selling cars makes money and a RWD Corolla would sell big time. Better then Scions do anyway. That's really what this thred is about. It's easier to use a known name like Toyota and just make sportier cars then it is to try and launch a new car line under a different name.

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Toyota used to sell a RWD Corolla back in the 80s. It really isn't that hard to make a car RWD and it doesn't cost that much more. A drive shaft and rear axle doesn't cost that much more. Also, it's better to have a shifter at the transmission then using shifter cables for FWD.

 

I'm not expecting for Toyota to ever make a RWD Corolla or Celica ever again, but I don't understand why they stopped in the first place. As far as making money. Selling cars makes money and a RWD Corolla would sell big time. Better then Scions do anyway. That's really what this thred is about. It's easier to use a known name like Toyota and just make sportier cars then it is to try and launch a new car line under a different name.

 

I disagree that it is easier to stick with a current name and just make sportier cars. Think about it, why did toyota launch Lexus, why not just keep the Toyota name and sell nicer cars? The answer is simple, people don't walk into Toyota showrooms expecting a luxury car and the price tag that comes with it. Toyota knew that if they were ever to get a premium price for a car that it couldn't wear a Toyota badge, and thus they created Lexus.

 

The same is true with Scion, the Toyota name doesn't mean much to most younger buyers. Toyota wants a piece of that market share and are smart enough to know that they won't get it by putting a Toyota badge on the front of the car. Scion was necessary in order to get Toyota into the youth market, whether you guys like it or not, it was a smart move by Toyota.

 

People don't believe in branding, but sales numbers prove that it works. People aren't smart enough to realize a Scion is a Toyota with body-work, or that some Lexus cars are Toyota clones. Thousands of units each year and millions of dollars in sales have proved that Toyota can get more for a Lexus ES330 than a Toyota Avalon despite the fact that a Avalon is actually a larger and nicer automobile.

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I understand what you are saying. I'm not sure what Japanise company spawned a premium line first. Lexus, Acura, or Infinity. They are Toyota, Honda, and Nissan wraped in lexury and hopefully performance.

 

Scion however is the first factory rice car ready to mod from Toyota. Back when gas prices where really high, I acually looked at a Xa cause the Echo wasn't made anymore and I wanted something cheap. At first I just looked on scion.com. The web sight was a little anoying, but the Xa starts at $13,270 MSRP. I figured a nice stereo, a 5sp, it would work. Looking in to it some more, I learn that the 103HP 1.5L is only good for a 32/37MPG fuel economy for a 5sp.. The same car that is basicly a Echo has some pretty lousy fuel economy. Did the stereo add all that weight or what?!?!?! Well, I thought I would go to the dealer on Sunday just to see one in person. The online pics looked acceptable. The Toyota dealer only had one, but they had added so much worthless crap to it (they riced it out), that the sticker was acually close to 19K. I was so pissed. It's a good think it was Sunday cause I think I would have laughed out loud at any sales people. Now, I'm just so turned off by Scion, I'm acually just a little turned off at Toyota now.

 

Toyota might have wanted to spawn off a new car name and sell cars to young people, but Scion is the black sheep of the family. I only know one person who acually owned one and he had the Tc. I pretty decent looking car. I'll give it that. Anyway, he traded it in on a 06 Honda cause he said the Tc had too many strange noises in it. He wasn't happy with quality. I'm sure glad I didn't buy one. I think I would have regreted it.

 

As far as sales goes, I really havn't seen that many on the road. Toyota is selling them, but they didn't come up with a great car(s) that is selling really well. Only time will tell if it was worth it. It could still be a bust.

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Honda's Acura line was first, debuting in 1986. Lexus and Infiniti both came along in 1989.

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The interesting thing about the Scion is, young people don't seem to be buying them -- at least not around here. Whenever I see a Scion, it's always an XB (the Box, I call it) and it's usually being driven by a mid-40's to mid-50's female. If I've seen 100 xB's on the road, probably 2 were being driven by some 20-something kid covered in tatoos and piercings. The rest of 'em are in Civics, Neons, and Focuses (Focii?). It seems like middle-aged women like the xB because it can carry a lot of stuff. There's even a couple in town with company logos on the sides, being used as compact delivery wagons. Toyota seems to have missed the mark with the xB the same way Chrysler did with the PT Cruiser.

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Larry- same in my corner of the world. There are numerous xBs on the roads, and all driven by middle aged women. There also lots of tCs, and those seem to be driven by women (tho younger), just like the Celica was. I've only seen a couple xAs, but only in parking lots, so I don't know who is driving those.

Edited by Max

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Yeaah, I've notice Scion sells well to middle aged people. Just like the "Youth Market" Element from Honda. Fact is, the youth market is automatically not going to respond to anything that is marketed to them.

 

I love Scions. The xA has great demensions for such a small vehicle. I think a turbo is needed to give the box cars a chance performance -wise though.

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