The dealer just cleared two engine codes for me. PO441 - incorrect purge flow
and PO446 - vent control curcuit malfunction
They said they would fix it for $318, just to put in a charcoal cannister. I want to check the cannister and clean it, but I can't locate it. Is it on the driver side of the engine bay?
They want $54 to replace the interior door pull which broke. Guess I'm goin' to the junkyard. I could expect worse from a '98 with 154k.

Also, any ideas if this could be more than just the charcoal cannister?

The canister is right by the fuel tank tucked up next to the rear subframe. Will be quite a pain getting to it - but should be doable.

The codes you posted are most likely the carcoal canister or the VSV that are connected to it. Might be able to get away with just replacing the valves - but it could be a flooded charcoal canister - that will have to be replaced.

I read some instructions in chilton's on cleaning the cannister by forcing compressed air through it. Do you think that would be enough? If it is cracked, I suppose it will have to be replaced.

thanks again, fishexpo101 you're the man!

Sometimes that works - if no liquid is present in the canister. Once liquid hits the activated charcoal in the can, it will be rendered useless. I've eard many stories of people trying to dry them out, replacing the charcoal, etc. - but in the end, they ended up replacing it. You should be able to get one at a much better price than what the dealer is quoting.

Good Luck.

Oh my God, DON'T DO IT! Or if you do, make sure the pressure is real low. I had a charcoal canister explode in my hands while forcing 120psi through it (I was a bit drunk at the time...). Approach with caution.

lol

Yep, the chilton manual actually gave pressure specifications, which were very low.
The part form the dealer is $222, so I will probably go to a junkyard. I'll let you know how it goes.

The canister is under the rear portion of the car, above the rear muffler.The purge solenoid and canister can be purchased from 1atoyota.com or something like that for alot less monety shipped to your door.
The door pull, (I just replaced,)
can be bought off EBAY for ~$20 shipped. It's a two minute replacement job.

Thanks for the info! I just went to a junkyard for the part.

Door handle - $10
Sunvisor - $15
Seeing the look on the dealers face when i tell them these 'fixed themselves,' - priceless

Here is an update.

I haven't replaced the charcoal cannister. It still drives alright, although it could use a little tuning up. CEL is on most of the time. Occasionally it will go off for a few hours, but then it is right back. Should I bother replacing this? I was thinking of putting in a new O2 sensor. I read in another post about someone havein similar problems, and just replacing the Sensor... is this the O2 sensor?

Ross t. I couldn't find the website you mentioned, but I sent you an email about the parts you have for sale...

Anton

I doubt it is the O2 sensor with the OBD-II codes you mentioned earlier. More likely to be one of the VSV valves in the EVAP system (usally runs about $70 a valve). I had EVAP problems early on when I bought My Corolla (bought new - first CEL at ~30K-35K). Dealer didn't do anything when the car was under warranty - even with the EPA ruling in hand for emissions regs and warranty claims - they claimed owner abuse or misuse caused my problems (total BS). Eventually I replaced the cutoff valve on the top of the tank (rubber gasket - $30 shipped), dealer wanted $300 labor + $350 for the vapor canister - even when their own diagnostics could not prove beyond a doubt that it was a bad vapor canister.

About 90K miles later - EVAP problems came back - this time it was a valve. 5K miles later, CEL pointed to a clogged canister - checked it out - was OK, turned out to be a cracked vacuum hose. Just keep at it - you'll eventually run across the problem. Sometimes even wiggling and tightening the rubber hoses under there can make the CEL go away. Most EVAP issue will not kill the car - just cause problems with emissions. If you need to get the car E-checked or smog checked - then you will have to fit it.

I had good luck with the purge valve replacement. Check online if your Corolla is eligable for the extended emission warranty. Contact the EPA if Toyota refuses help and you're within the criteria for the extended warranty.

Would a defective charcoal canister cause a foul exhaust odor or would this most likely be the 02 sensor that has 130K? I recently posted an inquiry with a p0420 code and replaced the CAT. I sure am learning alot from this forum and appreciate the knowledge. With 130K miles I may be a regular visitor.

Thanks

So the door handle is also known as a door pull? I have replaced most of mine, but for some reason the model years are not all the same. I have posted another thread in this forum about me getting the wrong inside door handles from a junkyard. They looked identical but I found out that the 1993 - 1997's do not all use the same one as I was under the wrong impression. I paid $5 for the inside ones and $11 for the outside. Anyone want to purchase them from me?

Well, Thanks for the info. I looked into the Extended emissions warranty. I spoke with Toyota customer service. They said I was beyond the warranty period. Well, there is 162k mi on the beast, so I can understand that. I think I will look into the purge valve replacement.

high tidings,
Anton

You could try the junkyards again. Just replace the charcoal cannister. It is probably cheaper for you to do it than to have it done by the dealer.

most charcoal canisters are ruined by topping off the tank with gas, theres a level at which the vent in the tank becomes submerged. once its submerged then any pressure in the tank pushes liquid fuel into the canister which can cause some pretty nasty things if it gets really badly filled with liquid fuel.

cramming in an extra $1 of gas could cost you several hundred $1's later on.

This week I got some time to work on it. I took out the Cannister and replaced some of the hoses (most of the smaller ones.) Also I replaced the VSV on the cannister. I cleared the DTC's and they stayed clear for about a week, then returned. Actually, I haven't checked to see that they are the same codes.

I may have topped off a few times. Now I know better, and I make a point of telling any gas station attendant about this as well. Also, it is a used vehicle, so the damage could be more than just mine.

I have to go under again just to replace the bracket on the muffler. It was pretty rusted up. anyway, I don't know if going to a junkyard for a cannister would be useful, because they could be ruined from topping off. How could I tell if the cannister was messed up without installing it? I guess I could pull codes from cars at the junkyard, assuming they would still have the ignition, ecu, battery...


Anton

This topic should probably be in 'corolla general', if the moderator could please move it there, thanks.

Hard to tell from salvage yard pieces - check for physical damage first. Any cracks = dead vapor canister. Sometimes you'll be luck and find a canister filled with liquid gas (usually) = not salvageable. Other times the canister was saturated with gasoline, then had it evaporate later - still not salvageable, since the activated charcoal inside will be ruined once liquid gas gets in there.

Better off to get a brand new one - seen them a slow as $160 online for a brand new OEM part.

What kind of a bad design is that - charcoal cannister gets ruined by topping of fuel?? I try to get as much fuel as I can into my tank at every fill-up. I drive 100 miles a day and it doesn't take long to need a re-fill. At least my cannister is under the hood and isn't affected by a full fuel tank.

Actually - the design is pretty elegant for what it accomplishes . The canister is much smaller and flexible (computer control) than previous designs - but with a smaller canister, any "oops" will not be able to be absorbed by the system. They even tell you not to top of the tank in the included documentation - but its hard not to resist craming an extra gallon or so for that extra 30-40 miles or more range.

How could they have designed it so that it would not be affected by a "Topped-off" tank?? Seems like that would have been better.

I'm sure they do have a better design (2003+ Corolla are not a susceptible = more expansion room and anti-siphon feature) - but bean counters will always have the final say. NOte this also affected many arly Prius models - but they also had a worse time, sometimes the gas gauge would be way off.

Doesn't matter how many warnings you stamp all over the car - people will do whatever is more convenient for their current needs. Things to keep in mind when "topping off" - doesn't just affect the vapor canister on the car:

- Could result in your paying for gasoline that is fed back into the station’s tanks because your gas tank is already full. Gas stations pumps are equipped with vapor recovery systems that feeds back gas vapors into the their tanks to prevent gas vapors pollutant from escaping into the air. When your tank is full (pump shuts off due to pressure differential - vapors and even liquid gasoline is redirected to the station’s storage tanks)

- You've just used up the expansion room (extra space needed for gasoline expansion). This will cause gasoline vapors and liquid gasoline to have nowhere else to go except into your vehicle’s vapor collection system (this is how the vapor canister gets filled with gas)

- Also causes the fouling of the station’s vapor recovery system (they have a bigger version of your charcoal canister). Potentially causing excess vapors to excape the system and possibly cause the gas pump to fail to work properly for the next person.

Just the prospect of giving away more money at the pump and knowing how much gasoline expands - caused me to never top off.

I have the problem of trying to cram too much gas into my tank at the fill-ups. I tend to top it off to the point where it starts to come out the filler neck. It usually runs down the body to the ground and at todays prices, that's wasted money. Doesn't always happen, just when I try to round off the dollar amount and accidently go over and then try for the next even amount.

Update:
After the work, 50% success. CEL back on, this time only one DTC. P0441, incorrect purge flow. I guess the P0446 was fixed by the new VSV.

I'm happy enough with these results, and I don't think I will be chaging the canniser any time soon.

Anton